johannesvanderwhales, (edited )

They run this same story about third party candidates every election year. The problem is they never show that the people who voted for the third party candidate would’ve definitely gone to one party or the other. People know what’s at stake, why do you assume people voting for RFK Jr would’ve voted for Biden? There’s nothing about his platform that is very left leaning. The most left leaning thing about him is his last name.

Edit: Just as an example, I voted for Nader in 2000. I’m someone who would’ve voted for Gore otherwise. But guess what? I was voting in a state that wasn’t in close contention at all, so I could vote for a third party without really changing the calculus of who would get elected. The idea that votes for third parties are fungible with votes for major party candidates is just not accurate.


Pollsters do ask “if the election was held today, between X and Y, who would you vote for”, for multiple combinations of candidates, so you can infer some of those opinions. I don’t think they explicitly ask people to rank their choices, or at least I haven’t seen those polls.


RFK Jr. is a piece of dog shit drying in the hot summer sun. I can't imagine in any universe this guy (who makes me wish there was a Sirhan Sirhan Jr.) draining votes from Joe Biden when their views are diametrically opposed.


Really, really low-information voters might see the last name and think he’s like JFK.


That’s most of his base.


RFK is the JFK.


I believe the latest polls show Bobby Kennedy Jr. taking slightly more support from Trump. It makes sense. In order to support Kennedy, you have to listen to him first.

The conspiracy theorist label stops the left from even considering him. The voters who are more likely to give him a chance are on the right. They don’t care if he’s called a conspiracy theorist.


I think it's a mix that varies state from state based off the latest polling.


Could be, but it’s likely to tend toward Trump voters as time goes on. They’re less resistant to someone being unpopular in the mainstream media.

Being called crazy by the media is a prerequisite for right wing viewers to trust a candidate.


If anything, RFK will split the Republican (Russian) vote

This author is a dipshit


I don’t know this author, but when I see articles like this I always think it’s a reverse Hanlon’s razor. I refuse to believe the people reporting on it are stupid and assume they’re fucking evil.


I said this in another post, but i believe older democrats who dont keep up with the nonsense of politics could very well just see the name Kennedy and vote for him. If we werent in a very red state i would be worried about my grandfather in his 80s doing exactly that.


I thought that was Jr's goal? He seems to be chumming up with right wing conspiracies pretty well.


how is that going to draw in people who would have otherwise voted for the boring mainstream democratic candidate?


He seems to specifically be gunning for the demographic of both right and left wing people that support pseudoscience nonsense. All the anti-vaxxers, for example. It's certainly entirely possible he'd steal more voters from Trump than from Biden.


Idk he really appeals to my desire to have a stupider, less popular trump. And he's a Kennedy!

/s, because this is the internet


Vote Blue No Matter Who! /s


No they can’t


Nader 2000, anyone?


RFK is way more appealing to the maga crowd than mainstream or progressive Dems.


How about Cornell West?


Appeals to no one anymore


Who? I’ve literally never heard of this person prior to now. And I’d like to think I stay fairly up-to-date on US politics.

So yeah, I’m going to go with probably not.

Ghostalmedia, (edited )

He’s pretty well known among the folks that are big on social justice and environmental issues. I would argue that he’s the biggest name to be on the Green ticket since Nader.

And he doesn’t have to be know by everyone to fuck over Biden. This is going to be a close race. Spoiling a race means that it could come down to a few more votes than normal for the Greens.

Edit: he’s running as an independent now.


The best way to discredit him is with his stance on Ukraine.…

He’s going the with “NATO forced them to” talking point, and he’s against additional funding for Ukraine. I don’t think many people truly on the left will pick him over Biden. Let’s hope not, at least.


he never said NATO forced them he said it’s illegal.

Evilcoleslaw, (edited )

To be fair, he’s against the US providing international military aid and funding across the board, not just Ukraine.


West isn’t green


nader didn’t put bush in the whitehouse


Definitely debatable. Nader had 97k votes in Florida, and Gore needed about 500.

There are a number of variables that arguably screwed Gore. The ballot format, the chads, the court, the completion from the left, etc. Many argue that removing any one of those variables could’ve likely tipped things for Gore.


Gore won florida


The point is that you’re more vulnerable to shenanigans with a tight margin.


let’s put blame for Bush’s presidency on bush


Going to back to the point of this thread. Someone like West is not going to win. Vote for him if you want, but if you’re in a state that is going to be tight, voting for him will make it easier for the far right candidate to get certified.


Spoiler Effect


The problem is the people running the DNC

At some point, we’re going to have to make an actual left wing party. Because the only thing the national DNC cares about is money

They don’t even know how to spend it effectively when they get it.


Socialist Party of America, Socialist Alternative, The Communist Party of the USA, and plenty others have been trying to run left of the Democratic Party for a century, it won’t work in a FPTP voting system, converting the Democrats into a Socialist party would literally be easier.

If you want a left wing party other than the Dems, you’re gonna have to change FPTP first.


converting the Democrats into a Socialist party would literally be easier.

They’re a private organization…

They’ll keep doing whatever they want without changing as long as people keep voting for him.

The only thing the DNC has that a different private party wouldn’t is momentum.

If they just gonna keep following the rnc, we have no choice but acknowledging we were abandoned long ago already


The DNC is a national political party organization. Every four years the entire party is reorganized from the ground up. It’s actually a pretty well created organizational system, the only people who really bitch about it are they keyboard warriors who have no understanding of it or the crazies who cannot fathom why they need other people to agree with them.


Reorganized from the ground up… to be exactly the same. They’re not left.

This is Pelosi telling progressives and the left to F off…

Bernie_Sandals, (edited )

The Democratic Party and the DNC and all the affiliates are nothing more than tools for whatever vaguely left of american center interest group wants to use them.

There’s no massive conspiracy to keep the Democrats Neoliberal, and if there is anything even similar to that, it’s happening behind closed doors in Wall Street, not Washington.

They’ll keep doing whatever they want without changing as long as people keep voting for him.

How long have you been involved in politics? I dont mean for that to sound demeaning. We’ve gone from Neoliberal democrats and Clinton gutting social welfare in the 90s to Socialists being integrated into the broader coalition, both parties have changed and will continue to change immensely over time. Ignoring that because you’re upset about Bernie losing the primary in 2016 and 2020 and disconnecting completely from the party is just a ticket to irrelevance, and I say that as someone who worked on some of Bernie’s first barnstorm events and both presidential campaigns.


Or or, and hear me out here. We could do what has happened many different times throughout history. And take over/replace the structure of a party. The Democrats already ignore state and local elections across several red states. What if we lefties/socialist/etc instead of trying to prop up separate parties and separate candidates that always fail. Fielded our own candidates who more closely match our own ideals. And run them as Democrats in these areas. Focusing on funding them ourselves as well as whatever money the DNC apparatus might provide. We might actually start winning. And if we start winning we might actually be able to replace those in the DNC. And if we replace those in the DNC. Things might actually get better.


This is what the DSA has been trying to do and succeeding in for 30 years with candidates like AOC


Isn’t that what they said?

converting the Democrats into a Socialist party would literally be easier


We should all know by now that that’s not how it’s going to have to work. The way to change politics in a country isn’t from the outside. It’s not even from the inside really, it’s by getting inside and then tearing out all the support beams of fixtures and rebuilding it from the inside out. That’s what conservatives under the Republican party for the last 15 to 20 years. They completely took over the party ousted all the ones that were too moderate for them, they rebuilt their party from the inside to be what it is today. Leftists are going to have to have the discipline to do the same.


And what about the people running the RNC?

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